Talk:You Really Got Me

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Contradiction[edit]

The article says "as everyone involved in the July 1964 recording sessions for the track has always maintained" and "Talmy credits him (Page) for the rhythm guitar [9] and Lord for the solo" at the same time. --Scieberking (talk) 18:08, 17 January 2010 (UTC)Reply[reply]

To put it simply, Lord and Page did not even know who Ray and Dave Davies were until a month or two after the sessions for YRGM - they were brought in for the LP sessions only, in late August/early September (see Hinman, Doug - p. 34). Therefore, the article is probably incorrect. - I.M.S. (talk) 18:20, 17 January 2010 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks for the info. So are you trying to say that Jon Lord too didn't play keyboards on YRGM? --Scieberking (talk) 19:35, 19 January 2010 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sure! And to answer your other question, Hinman lists Arthur Greenslade on piano. Here is the complete personnel, per Doug Hinman:
  • Ray Davies: lead vocal, harmonica
  • Dave Davies: lead guitar, backing vocal
  • Pete Quaife: bass guitar, backing vocal
  • Bobby Graham: drums
  • Unknown rhythm guitar player [not Page]
  • Arthur Greenslade on piano
  • Mick Avory on tambourine

Recorded IBC studios, central London: mid-July 1964, 1-track to 1-track mono. Produced by Shel Talmy, Engineered by Glyn Johns. - I.M.S. (talk) 01:08, 20 January 2010 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks again I.M.S., but I've always thought that most musicians agree it was Jon Lord on the keyboards. I remember reading a Ray Davies interview where he acknowledges Jon's contribution. Will try to provide you the link. Best Regards. --Scieberking (talk) 10:18, 20 January 2010 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Cover Versions[edit]

Why isn't Oingo Boingos cover version of this song mentioned in here? They did do one on the Only A Lad album and it is worth mentioning in this article —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.16.45.234 (talk) 16:14, 20 April 2010 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Cover versions - citation dead, replaced, moved here[edit]

About it getting airplay with "Eruption": "http://forum.guitarherogame.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=6745, retrieved 2009-01-29." 1) Not at web.archive.org or Webcitation 2) it was a forum, anyways WP:RS 3) forums moved 4) forum search won't allow search for "you really got me", and "Eruption". Search for Eruption produced no relevant entry for claim in article. Citation replaced. --Lexein (talk) 03:42, 27 June 2010 (UTC)Reply[reply]

jimmy page on kink's' 'you really got me'[edit]

i have a 1970 creem magazine where jimmy page talks about his early session work including 'them' the 'who' and of course the 'kinks' ..he simply says he played on them....i have several other interviews stating the same..and of course in 1969 at the whisky in l.a. when led zeppelin played..jimmy page told me in person..just listen to 'choker' or 'snakedrive' with eric lapton...same years...same tones.. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.102.21.35 (talk) 23:16, 29 January 2011 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Bold, revert, now discuss[edit]

In this series of edits, material was boldly moved out of the Van Halen section into a Trivia section, then inline citations were removed, and some text formatting was broken. I'm reverting. Please note that explicit trivia sections or lists are generally deprecated, in favor of prose in context. The history of the use of the Van Halen version serves to illustrate its ongoing, reliably sourced, impact in popular culture, and can't simply be unilaterally declared "trivia." If there are issues with any particular item, or its sourcing, or the prose, please discuss here first, per WP:Bold, revert, discuss. --Lexein (talk) 13:32, 29 April 2011 (UTC)Reply[reply]

December 2012[edit]

In the 2008 film, "It Might Get Loud", Page is explicitly asked if he ever did any work for the Kinks. His answer, " Yeah, I did some Kinks stuff." So if he didn't do the solo on "You Really Got Me", what the heck did he do? Ppynenburg (talk) 06:36, 4 January 2012 (UTC)Reply[reply]

(moved comment to date order). Good question. --Lexein (talk) 19:20, 4 January 2012 (UTC)Reply[reply]
He did "I'm a Lover Not a Fighter" and "I've Been Driving On Bald Mountain" on the band's 1st album. Beatleswhobeachboys (talk) 21:19, 17 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Heavy metal?[edit]

The song predates the cultural origins (late 1960's to early 1970's) of heavy metal, consequently making the song an antecedent. The sources provided in the text state that the track was nothing more than an influence for what was to be later known as heavy metal; with its influence on punk rock also being noted. If "You Really Got Me" is metal, then we might as well say Link Way's instrumentals and the Kingsmen's "Louie Louie" are also heavy metal seeing as there are equal amounts of sources stating each acts influence on the genre. Rvd4life (talk) 01:53, 11 April 2012 (UTC)Reply[reply]

It could be classified as proto-metal and proto-punk. Ledheadtilldeath (talk) 00:30, 23 May 2012 (UTC)Reply[reply]

GA Review[edit]

GA toolbox
Reviewing
This review is transcluded from Talk:You Really Got Me/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Ojorojo (talk · contribs) 18:06, 26 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I'll be happy to review this. Give me a couple of days to put my initial comments together. —Ojorojo (talk) 18:06, 26 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi Ojorojo! Thanks for taking the time to review this. Beatleswhobeachboys (talk) 18:23, 26 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Very interesting article about a true classic of the era. Close to GA-status, but needs some MOS tweaks. —Ojorojo (talk) 14:50, 27 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Ojorojo: First set of revisions done - did some rewording and added new info to lead, minor changes to infobox. Beatleswhobeachboys (talk) 00:32, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Beatleswhobeachboys, I've made some minor corrections that I thought were easier than listing them. Change if you disagree. —Ojorojo (talk) 23:26, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Ojorojo - thanks for correcting: I only changed one little grammar error (Dave Davies was referred to as the Kink's guitarist, which I changed to Kinks'). Beatleswhobeachboys (talk) 23:31, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Good job, let's wrap it up. Please finish the bit about the quotes in the lead (see Lead "Power chords/influence second section" below). I made a few corrections, change as you see fit. —Ojorojo (talk) 21:17, 30 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Ok. I didn't make any revisions: I think your edits were very good in cleaning up the article. Beatleswhobeachboys (talk) 21:50, 30 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Added some more stuff - expanded live, added a couple more facts in the other sections, and created a "Music and lyrics" section for that bit in the lead that wasn't in the body. Change anything you need to. Beatleswhobeachboys (talk) 01:07, 2 May 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Infobox[edit]

  • 7" single
    • Appears too informal, maybe seven-inch single? Or seven-inch 45 rpm single? —Ojorojo (talk) 14:50, 27 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Changed to 7" 45 rpm single
        • OK, several song FAs use 7", although WP:UNITS Specific units states "Do not use ′ (′), ″ (″), apostrophe/​single quote (') or double quote (")", instead use "in" if necessary to abbreviate. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:30, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
          • OK, will change

Lead[edit]

  • References and links in the lead
    • According to WP:LEADCITE, sources in the lead are not necessary, except for actual quotes, because the material must be included and referenced in the body. Also, links should be used for topics that are closely related to the subject MOS:CONTEXTLINK. Maybe, unlink words like single, UK singles chart, hit song, etc. —Ojorojo (talk) 14:50, 27 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Removed most citations
  • It was released..., It was the group's..., It was later included...
  • Power chords/influence second section
    • The first sentence seems redundant, plus quotes in the lead must be included in the body. Maybe leave/expand the first sentence and move the second with the quotes to the "Recording" section. —Ojorojo (talk) 14:50, 27 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Reworked paragraph; the second sentence is still in the opening, but I have merged the first sentence into the other parts
        • Maybe you just haven't added it yet, but neither the ideas in the quotes nor the refs are included in the body of the article. According to WP:LEAD, "Apart from trivial basic facts, significant information should not appear in the lead if it is not covered in the remainder of the article." Perhaps address the use of guitar power chords and the song as precursor to hard rock and heavy metal along with the use of distortion in the "Recording" or "Release and reception" sections. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:17, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • No mention of writing or recording
    • A mention of going through several demos and their struggle to record their vision may be interesting (and a brief mention of the Page controversy). —Ojorojo (talk) 14:50, 27 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Done.
  • Quotation marks outside of punctuation
    • Unless the actual quotation does differently, quotation marks (including for song titles) should go inside punctuation (MOS:QUOTEMARKS). —Ojorojo (talk) 14:50, 27 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Done.
  • No mention of Van Halen
    • Since there is a long section devoted to their version, some overview should be included in the lead. —Ojorojo (talk) 14:50, 27 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Added VH
  • "Best of" details
    • The lead should include a general overview and not be burdened with too many details. Maybe, "'YRGM' was inducted into the GHOF and several music publications have included it on various 'Best of' lists in recognition of its enduring popularity and influence". Also, the details need to be included somewhere in the body, such as an "Accolades/Recognition/Awards" section. —Ojorojo (talk) 14:50, 27 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Moved info down to Release & Reception section

Background[edit]

  • 'YRGM' was first written by Ray Davies ...
    • Up to this point, he hasn't been identified. Maybe include, "...Ray Davies, the Kinks' vocalist and main songwriter ..."
      • Done.
  • the song's characteristic riff came about while working out the chords of The Kingsmen's "Louie Louie"
    • Chronologically, I think this refers to the last, guitar-power chord driven version and should be listed last. The blues and jazz references probably apply more to the inspiration and earlier versions. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:30, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Done.

Recording[edit]

  • The amplifier was affectionately called "little green" ... slaved into a Vox AC-30.
    • Correct me if I'm wrong, but slaving essentially uses one amp's pre-amp in place of or in addition to a second amp's pre-amp. In other words, little green's pre-amp would be driving the Vox's power section with all the sound coming out of the latter – little green's power section (and its output to the "modified" speaker would be bypassed). To get the little green speaker sound out of the Vox, it would have to be miked, a different technique than slaving. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:30, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • OK. I personally am not very knowledgeable about these techinques, so I will take your word for it.
        • I re-read the ref and it's not clear exactly how he did it, so I changed it to something more consistent with the vague ref. —Ojorojo (talk) 23:26, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Recent Kinks' releases have given full official credits ...
    • Does this mean writer's credits or performance credits? If the latter, who were listed as the performers before? —Ojorojo (talk) 13:30, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Reworded.

Guitar solo[edit]

  • ... one of the most controversial and persistent myths in all of rock and roll ..."
    • This type of statement needs an inline citation to a RS. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:30, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Cut this phrase.
  • ... UK rhythm and blues community ...
  • ... interview with the blog Finding Zoso:
    • Even though it's an interview, fansite blogs are problematic (WP:USERG, WP:BLOGS). I think the Sound on Sound, Guardian and Sirius interviews provide enough RS on the Page issue and FZ is unneeded. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:30, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Cut this quote.
  • Ray Davies, in his autobiographical release Storyteller ...
    • This is a difficult paragraph. How about something like "In his autobiographical release Storyteller, Ray Davies discusses the guitar solo. He confirms that his brother Dave played the solo and it was preceded by some bantering between the two: 'Halfway through the song ... [cite using Template:Cite AV media for track on Storyteller (LyricsTime.com is probably copyrightvio)]"" —Ojorojo (talk) 17:30, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Done.
        • Removed ref to ASIN (Amazon product number). Replaced LyricsTime.com with cite media. —Ojorojo (talk) 23:26, 28 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Release and reception[edit]

Live history[edit]

  • Infobox
    • This single doesn't appear important enough for an infobox – the references don't provide critical commentary and it didn't chart. Also, the subsection is too small to allow for it. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:19, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • I don't know... to me it makes navigation a lot easier. Also, lots of links to the song redirect to this section, making it a good visual. I can cut out much of the redundant info (writer, genre, format, etc.) and maybe the pic, though. I'll try to find more for the live info as well.
  • Both Ray and Dave Davies still perform the song ...
    • Since this probably comes later in the chronology, it would be better at the end of the subsection. A ref would also be helpful. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:19, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Moved to end: would setlist.fm be a reliable source for the ref? Otherwise, I can't find a source.
        • Not entirely necessary (setlist.fm is user generated, so it can't be used). —Ojorojo (talk) 21:52, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Personnel[edit]

    • This section is unneeded. The 1964 version personnel is already listed in the "Recording" section and the 1979 live version is not important enough for a listing. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:19, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Removed.

Charts[edit]

  • Year-end charts
    • Please move further to the right, so they appear more as two columns and don't abut. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:19, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Done.
  • Chart succession
    • This should be placed at the footer, directly above the artist navboxes ("Little Red Rooster" provides an example of identifying a particular version in an article). —Ojorojo (talk) 17:19, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Done.

Van Halen version[edit]

  • Infobox
    • The "Format" field should be consistent with the Kinks' infobox. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:19, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Done.
  • Cover
    • "Cover" is overused in this section (at one time "cover song" had a negative implication). Maybe alternate with some other wordings. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:19, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Done.
  • as an "updated" version of the original ...
    • Are there any RS that might discuss how it differs from the original?
      • Added allmusic quotes.
  • The Kinks' Dave Davies has gone on record ..
  • He also told of how Kinks fans ...
    • If the ref, Davies says "Some kid came up to me after one of the gigs". Also, the cite lists "Road Runner Records" but the link is to Blabbermouth. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:19, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Fixed.
  • ... how Van Halen fans have approached him ..
  • Ray Davies, on the other hand ...
    • I remember hearing a live version by the Kinks (1980s?), where Ray parodies one of Roth's vocal mannerisms. It's a good example of his sense of humor. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:19, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • That's pretty clever on Ray's part! I'll try to find a reliable source to add that.
        • Having trouble finding anything: if you had a source for this live version, it would be much obliged. Beatleswhobeachboys (talk) 22:31, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
          • I listened to 4–5 live versions from this period and didn't find it. It is interesting that in concert, the Kinks often deconstructed the song and ad libbed portions. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:12, 30 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • References
    • For consistency, references that have author, title, year, publisher, ISBN should be listed in "Sources" subsection, with sfn used for citation with page. These include Creswell and Walser. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:12, 30 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • OK: revised
  • Infobox: "Hard rock" – ref link is dead. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:12, 30 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Used different source
  • Recording: full performance credits – Picture Book links to album review, not booklet; The Kinks Deluxe Edition uses cite web but has no link. Change both using Template:Cite AV media notes and link with OCLC #s. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:12, 30 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Used AV media
  • Release and reception: in BBC poll – provide cite; Q magazine and VH1 – citations incorrectly show orig & archive info. Use temp cite web to show similar info as Rolling Stone ref. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:12, 30 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    • Re-did cite
  • Live history: remained a mainstay in concert – since there are page numbers for the rest of the Hinman refs, this should have one too; even after twenty years ... – it would look more RS if the website were identified as "Dave Davies (official website)" or "davedavies.com" —Ojorojo (talk) 13:12, 30 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    • I did that because throughout the entire book there are setlists (not one specific statement that said it was a mainstay) I can cut it if it isn't relevant
  • Charts: Year-end charts – although titled "Official Charts Company" and Billboard Year-End, these appear to link to user generated-list sites that are not on WP:GOODCHARTS. Please replace or remove. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:27, 30 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    • Found new source for Billboard, cut UK chart
  • Images, etc.
    • The musical notation for the riff is unreferenced and misleading. It shows a key of B♭ major. Dave described writing it with alternating G and F chords and one sheet music chart shows the key of G major. The song itself sounds like A♭, although it later shifts to B♭, etc. (OR). Unless you can find a RS, this should be left out. —Ojorojo (talk) 21:52, 29 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • OK: image cut.
    • Why are "Guitar solo" and "Live history" subsections? It seems they function as regular sections. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:27, 30 April 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Criteria[edit]

GA review (see here for criteria)

Most of these points are addressed above. —Ojorojo (talk) 14:43, 3 May 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]

  1. It is reasonably well written.
    a (prose): b (MoS):
    The last MOS lead issue has been resolved.
  2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.
    a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
    The sources are RS.
  3. It is broad in its coverage.
    a (major aspects): b (focused):
    Covers all the points.
  4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.
    Fair representation without bias:
  5. It is stable.
    No edit wars etc.:
  6. It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate.
    a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
  7. Overall:
    Pass/Fail:
    Thanks Beatleswhobeachboys. The Kinks' Greatest Hits! was the first album I bought (mono, because it was more affordable $2.69?). This should qualify for DYK if you're interested. —Ojorojo (talk) 14:43, 3 May 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Ojorojo Thanks for passing! The Kinks are a great band with so many amazing songs (even in the eighties they could manage gems such as "Better Things" and "Come Dancing"), but info is kind of scarce. Though for the hits, such as this one and "Lola," there's more to find. Thanks for your in-depth review, once again! Beatleswhobeachboys (talk) 15:03, 3 May 2015 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Album track[edit]

The Wikipedia standard is that a non-album single retains non-album status when it is incorporated into a compilation album, but that it is an album single when it is incorporated into a studio album. Does not matter how it was released originally. The current infobox is misleading, so let's see if we can get some consensus on this. YouCanDoBetter (talk) 19:33, 28 October 2020 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Please include a link to the Wikipedia standard you are referring to. "Does not matter how it was released originally" is contradicted by Template:Infobox song#album: "If the song was first released on an album, enter the name of the album and link ... If the song was originally released as a single well in advance of the album, |album= should not be used, since it is not from the album, but later added to one". —Ojorojo (talk) 13:56, 29 October 2020 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'm not placing a vote either way, but I will note that songs like "Ticket to Ride" by The Beatles or "I Can See for Miles" by The Who, released before their respective albums by larger margins than "You Really Got Me", are considered album tracks. Many, many album tracks are released as lead singles, one or two or even several months before the album. The Wikipedia precedent seems to be for songs released one or more years before being placed on an album. But it's up to the community. SweetTaylorJames (talk) 19:14, 24 November 2020 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I appreciate your point, but don't think it's analogous. Help! is a soundtrack album and The Who Sell Out is a concept album: the songs were created more as a body of work to be released together. Kinks (You Really Me in the US) is the Kinks debut album and, at the time (1964), record companies often collected songs from various recording sessions to release as an album after a new artist had a successful single (Them's "Gloria"/"Baby, Please Don't Go" → The Angry Young Them/Them 6 mos later; Yardbirds "For Your Love" → For Your Love after 4 mos). From what I saw during the review, "You Really Got Me" was not considered as a lead single or that an album featuring it was even contemplated (about a half of its songs are covers and used some studio (non-group) musicians for recording). I'll go with the consensus, but think "from the album" (current infobox wording) means more than "on the album". —Ojorojo (talk) 17:46, 25 November 2020 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Missing personnel[edit]

GA missing personnel? Strange. Hey User:Tkbrett since you're a Kinks guy now you think we could fix this? – zmbro (talk) (cont) 01:05, 11 May 2022 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks zim. Since WikiProject Songs doesn't have a specific style guide, I guess it's not necessarily required, but like you I like to include one if reliable sourcing is available. There unfortunately aren't many sources for this band, though Doug Hinman does provide a complete personnel listing, so I've added his.Tkbrett (✉) 02:21, 11 May 2022 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:You_Really_Got_Me&oldid=1144258746"